The official Doctor Who thread - SPOILERS

Discussion in 'THE AIGBURTH ARMS' started by jmc2000, Jul 2, 2017.

  1. Underdunn

    Underdunn Deck Sergeant

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    Against my better judgement I watched last nights.

    It was basically Quantum Leap ffs - only even preachier (if such a thing were possible)

    Stupid programme.
     
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  2. jmc2000

    jmc2000 Deck Sergeant

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    I found last night's episode very powerful - the most emotional I've found Doctor Who for a long time. I actually thought it would be dull for me at best (because I prefer the future space stories to historical Earth ones), and, at worst, a misguided and patronising story that prompted a Twitter backlash. But it was my favourite episode for ages.

    I think an anti-racism message is worth preaching, and I give them huge amounts of credit for showing real 20th Century racism in a way that was genuinely shocking for an episode of Doctor Who. Given the context - a family show with a large following of children - I applaud them for wanting to preach this message on this platform. Also, a lot of people felt that this couldn't have been more timely, given the recent Ryan Air incident.

    Doctor Who has done allegories of racism using aliens before. But going to 1950s Alabama to show it for real was a bold choice, and I didn't expect them to show it so plainly. They didn't shy away from showing realistic scenes of bitter, snarling racism that were shocking to see in this prime time context (especially if you're a long time fan, with a frame of reference for what Doctor Who is normally like).

    When I watched a black member of the TARDIS team try to get a white woman's attention so he could return her dropped glove, and her husband turned round and brutally slapped him across the face, that was a shocking moment. I feel like I know where I am with Doctor Who and couldn't have been more surprised by that. Then the husband threatened Ryan with a lynching (!) and I knew we were in completely uncharted territory. The writers included racial slurs from "boy" to one - possibly two - that I don't feel comfortable typing even for illustration.

    There have been a couple of times (e.g. Christmas) when I've tried to put Doctor Who on with my family and ended up a bit embarrassed when they started ripping into it, lol. But there were moments in Rosa when I would have felt proud of my favourite show, if I'd been watching with non-fans, and think my family would have been quietly stunned by it.

    Some of the historical exposition was a bit direct, but it is a show for children (which has been lost a bit in recent years) and I'm sure they found it eye-opening and will be thinking about it long after it aired. Frankly, I learned a lot as well. I certainly wasn't as bad as the Ryan character (thinking Rosa Parks was the first black woman to drive a bus!) but I know a lot more about Rosa Parks than I did before the episode aired. If family entertainment now includes children learning about racism and Rosa Parks in a format they enjoy, I think that's good.

    In terms of the quality of the episode as a piece of entertainment, there were some things I'd mark down, but I thought it was great overall. Normally, I find it hard to get tense about Doctor Who, but I was on the edge of my seat when they were trying to work out if they'd put everything back to normal.

    I thought it was a questionable choice to do a time travel story around such a sensitive (and still recent) historical moment, and was terrified that they'd somehow make the Doctor responsible for it. They absolutely did the right thing when they made sure the time travellers didn't actually help or inspire Rosa Parks. They just made sure that no one else could meddle with her established timeline, so she would do what she'd always done alone. It was a very bold choice of story but I think they nailed it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2018
  3. jmc2000

    jmc2000 Deck Sergeant

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    Agreed on Jodie Whitaker, I really like her in the role.

    As for the larger TARDIS team... I'm reserving judgement. I think Ryan and Graham are superb and it's definitely worth having them both for the interplay between them. I haven't seen much to justify the inclusion of Yaz yet - all three stories would have worked without her - but it's early days, and I think the next episode is focussed around her. So, I'll report back with my verdict on three companions when we've had a few more episodes :-)
     
  4. Nicoca-cola Truck

    Nicoca-cola Truck Flight Co-Ordinator

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  5. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Console Officer

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    Yeah Quantum Leap sprung to my mind as well, I was liking the first episode thinking the new Who got off to a good start. Second episode was a huge disappointment though, complete drivel. I hope the rest of the series it isn't going to be like this.
     
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  6. Underdunn

    Underdunn Deck Sergeant

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    Incase you missed last nights episode, let me sum it up for you:

    Old white men are evil.

    See you all next week. x
     
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  7. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Console Officer

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    Well it has went a long way down hill quickly after the first episode.
     
  8. Christmas Pants

    Christmas Pants Science Officer

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    Afraid I just cannot stand her!!
     
  9. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Console Officer

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    At first I liked the quirky Yorkshire madness, but it has so quickly become very one dimensional. Poorly written.
     
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  10. Christmas Pants

    Christmas Pants Science Officer

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    Quite!
     
  11. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Console Officer

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    Well, after trying my best to watch the new Doctor Who I finally have to admit I can't watch any more. It is the worst pile of dog pooh I have ever had the misfortune to watch. Doctor Who has been off the telly for maybe 2 years now so I would expect some well thought out plots and scripts but what do we get, absolute smege.

    The Doctor = One dimensional
    Ryan = Wooden delivery
    Yaz and Graham = the only interesting parts.
    Rant over...…. for now.
     
  12. Kittypaws

    Kittypaws Flight Co-Ordinator

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    I stopped after the first three.
     
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  13. Cloud (Christmas)

    Cloud (Christmas) Flight Co-Ordinator

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    My friend made me watch Dr Who over 10 years ago, he had bigged it up so much. Then I watch it and they are on some space version of the weakest link and it was the cheesiest thing I had ever seen. It was dreadful.
     
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  14. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    The last one I watched was the first Matt Smith episode, which means I haven't seen the show in over eight years. I haven't missed it.
     
  15. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Console Officer

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    Wow, was it 8 years since Matt Smith first played the Doctor? where does the Time go? If only I had a Tardis !
     
  16. Christmas Pants

    Christmas Pants Science Officer

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    I think we all do to stop Chibnall ever getting his mitts on doctor who
     
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  17. Václav Claus

    Václav Claus Deck Sergeant

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    When you write it like this, it means one children's character has a naughty name...
     
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  18. jmc2000

    jmc2000 Deck Sergeant

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    I really like that series, and tonight's finale!

    The Woman Who Fell to Earth - good introduction to Jodie Whitaker. I really liked how different it felt and how good it looked. Doctor Who thrives on reinventing itself, and, by the end of Capaldi's tenure, I was just ready for something fresh and new. This delivered IMO. Middling story but this was more about the characters.

    The Ghost Monument - a solid, straightforward story, let down only by a) the villains being scary tea towels and b) some clumsy shoehorning-in of science stuff about a gas. There've been a few moments of forced info-dumping in this series, but I can forgive that, because there isn't enough of it to obstruct my enjoyment and it's a show for kids too.

    Rosa - the standout episode for me. Genuinely moving and tense in parts. The realistic portrayal of period racism was new ground for Doctor Who and really gave the episode some edge. My only complaint is, the villain could have been made a lot better just with casting.

    Arachnids in the UK - my least favourite episode. Silly story with too many coincidences and no great payoff.

    The Tsuranga Conundrum - really solid. The sets and soundtrack really worked to give it a good sci-fi feel. Great guest stars too. This was one of my faves.

    Demons of the Punjab - another corker. Normally I don't look forward to the historical episodes, but Rosa and Demons of the Punjab were both really interesting (in terms of the history) and moving as well. This one is part of the "peloton" of good episodes just behind Rosa.

    Kerblam! - really enjoyed this and didn't expect the twist. With the scary smiling robots, this felt the most like a Moffat-era Who. My only complaint is, the female guest star wasn't really mourned (unlike Lee Mack's character). Given that Kira had a sad-sounding life, I think they should have done more for her, but she was sort of forgotten.

    The Witchfinders - this had some strong stuff, like the main revenant, but it suffered from a mix of tone. I don't think the comical king quite gelled with the rest of the story. They should have left him out and made it a straight-up scary one. Also, the extras playing the other revenants were a really mixed bag. Towards the bottom of the list for me.

    It Takes You Away - very ambitious with a lot to like, but also some fumbles. I was gripped throughout, but I just wish they'd fleshed out the Antizone a tiny bit (just enough so I didn't feel like Ribbons being there was inexplicable). Also, bloody hell, someone should have script-edited out the frog (or found a better frog!).

    The Battle of Ranskoor Av Kolos - very strong finish with some lovely character payoffs. I had reservations about the thought that Tim Shaw might return to be the big baddy. However, I was pleasantly surprised. Script, acting, direction and photography all made him an extremely credible end-of-series villain. Graham's opening challenge to the Doctor was unexpected and made the whole episode very tense. Couple of grumbles: removing the head-things turned out to be a complete non-event, and how can a race that only has two people at any given time be found on three planets? Or did I mishear/mis-remember?

    Not my favourite series of New Who, but certainly not my worst. I was getting to the point where I was eager to see a new take on the show, so I'm really pleased to have got something that's noticeably different but still fun.

    I find Jodie Whitaker's Doctor really appealing. Some of her writing is a bit formulaic - "that reminds me of the time I [insert comical sounding anecdote about a famous historical character" - but she carries it off and I find her Doctor very likeable.
     
  19. jmc2000

    jmc2000 Deck Sergeant

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    Also, this is probably a damning indictment of how my mind works, but I look at @Václav Claus 's sig picture and have three different rude words jumping out at me from the first line of the caption.
     
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